No, I just want to be with you

[genie47]

This is how my mind wandered when Skoo posted his views on the sexual content of the film and in my opinion even more so for the novel - zombie Håkan's attempted rape not included.

From passage to passage, JAL describes a lot of sexually romantic situations between Oskar and Eli. Most telling is after Eli nommed Lacke. Both of them held each other sleeping. One can deduce they were dressed very little since it was written that they "got up and put on their clothes".

More so confirmed by JAL in the original Swedish commentary when he says that:

Oskar does have some thoughts to that direction but it never turns into anything.

To the extent he does, he gets to keep it to himself.

It's more because he knows that he should.

So here you have it. Two 12 year olds agreeing that sex should not be in this relationship of theirs even though the attraction is somewhat sexual. A sexual tension is present but also a maturity that is beyond their years is displayed.

Even though Eli is essentially a child, guarding Oskar's emotional health seems to be on top of her mind. I will also draw on the earlier thread we had on the Oskar and Håkan parallel. Oskar like Håkan does not force it on Eli. Like Håkan, Oskar have to repress his sexual desires brought about by just the simple human process of growing up.

Eli refuses Håkan's requests for sexual intimacy when he bargains with her. Eli also initially rejects Oskar's proposal. Under the same parallel comparison, Eli agrees to let Håkan touch her if he brings her blood. Eli agrees to be Oskar's girlfriend if things continue as they are! Woah! Oskar is indeed the new Håkan!

Difference? Eli let's Håkan go out and endanger himself. Eli is protecting Oskar's emotional health with that agreement for going steady.

The sexual nature of Eli's relationship with Håkan didn't bring clarity to Håkan at all. From his monologues, it was always the "demands and the desire". It was all physical needs with Håkan. The agreement between Oskar and Eli to keep the sexual element out of their relationship actually brought a lot of clarity to Oskar. There is this pressure that is lifted from him. OK why did I say clarity? Remember Eli offered to Oskar to "be like me?" Oskar refused! "I don't want to be like you, I want to be with you." And Eli understands. (cmfireflies likes this a lot) Quite like Twilight but in the opposite sense, the vampire is seduced by the mortal to give such an offer and the refusal is from the mortal.

Even though hand-holding, hugging and cuddling - all of which can be considered sexual in nature - were present in the novel, that first sleep-in scene has told Oskar directly that sex isn't an option and this means it is not just going to happen unexpectedly. From JAL's Swedish commentary, Oskar makes sure it is not going to happen. It's all courtship with Eli.

So this is where Oskar has success if you compared him with Håkan. Just for a simple act from Eli telling him flat out "let's keep this gross thing out"......

I try not to bash Twilight but I think here, LTROI is like Twilight. Except that Twilight used the vampire as a sexual being. The refusal by Edward to turn Bella is a metaphor for sexual abstinence. LTROI is far more effective presenting things as they are without using the metaphor of a vampire as a sexual being. What we actually read are two kindred souls who know that sex is going to bring about unwarranted complication in a relationship that is already complicated!

[ked101]

I read between the lines and thought it was open to interpretation; it would be difficult to publish sexual ideas between 12 yr olds. Eli agreed to let Haken touvh him - this must have happened before! I did not get the impression Eli was ignorant to sex. I did not get the impression that Oska refusing to be a vampire was anything other than Oska not wanting to be like Eli - but whos to say this will not happen in the end - my understanding about Eli's acknowledgement that Oska wanted to be human was of rejection - I thought he felt a little disappointment here.

As i have already said - Eli bargained with Haken for blood - If Eli was willing to use sex to buy blood (so to speak) then he will no doubt at some stage consider sex with the one he loves - stands to reason. The book was leading in that direction. If sex was to occur with Eli it would be for love - because I think Eli will understand that this is what people like and use to express love. Oska will eventually come around to this as he ages.

[lombano]

There was some nascent sexual tension on Oskar's part (not full-blown lust), obviously none from Eli. There are lots of parallels between Hakan and Oskar, but while the Hakan-Eli story is driven primarily by lust and self-interest, the Eli-Oskar story is driven primarily by love. It's almost as if Hakan was Oskar gone wrong, or Oskar Hakan gone right.
I didn't see the 'would you be like me?' dialogue as having a sexual dimension - JAL portrays vampires' hunger as of the non-sexual type, the urges of a non-sex-related illness. I read that dialogue as a statement of fact - Oskar does not wish to share Eli's affliction, he wants to be with Eli.
Since Eli cannot grow up, I really don't want to think of their relationship turning sexual.

[ked101]

There was some nascent sexual tension on Oskar's part (not full-blown lust), obviously none from Eli. There are lots of parallels between Hakan and Oskar, but while the Hakan-Eli story is driven primarily by lust and self-interest, the Eli-Oskar story is driven primarily by love. It's almost as if Hakan was Oskar gone wrong, or Oskar Hakan gone right.
I didn't see the 'would you be like me?' dialogue as having a sexual dimension - JAL portrays vampires' hunger as of the non-sexual type, the urges of a non-sex-related illness. I read that dialogue as a statement of fact - Oskar does not wish to share Eli's affliction, he wants to be with Eli.
Since Eli cannot grow up, I really don't want to think of their relationship turning sexual.

I'm sure the idea of sexuality for ELi is more complex than the infliction of being a vampire - since he is a castrated boy; however sex will be an issue as Oska ages because that how it is with teenagers whether its with Eli or somebody else

[lombano]

There was some nascent sexual tension on Oskar's part (not full-blown lust), obviously none from Eli. There are lots of parallels between Hakan and Oskar, but while the Hakan-Eli story is driven primarily by lust and self-interest, the Eli-Oskar story is driven primarily by love. It's almost as if Hakan was Oskar gone wrong, or Oskar Hakan gone right.
I didn't see the 'would you be like me?' dialogue as having a sexual dimension - JAL portrays vampires' hunger as of the non-sexual type, the urges of a non-sex-related illness. I read that dialogue as a statement of fact - Oskar does not wish to share Eli's affliction, he wants to be with Eli.
Since Eli cannot grow up, I really don't want to think of their relationship turning sexual.

I'm sure the idea of sexuality for ELi is more complex than the infliction of being a vampire - since he is a castrated boy; however sex will be an issue as Oska ages because that how it is with teenagers whether its with Eli or somebody else

Yes, of course sexuality will be an issue with Oskar. That's a big part of why I see the ending as bittersweet, because Eli will not age. In particular the very last line, 'Maybe when you're young' is very ominous.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by sexuality being more complex than being a vampire, but I imagine Eli would have a rather negative view of sexuality. Having no sex drive, he can't get any of its benefits, and he's surely known enough Hakans to have a rather negative impression of others' sexuality.

[ked101]

There was some nascent sexual tension on Oskar's part (not full-blown lust), obviously none from Eli. There are lots of parallels between Hakan and Oskar, but while the Hakan-Eli story is driven primarily by lust and self-interest, the Eli-Oskar story is driven primarily by love. It's almost as if Hakan was Oskar gone wrong, or Oskar Hakan gone right.
I didn't see the 'would you be like me?' dialogue as having a sexual dimension - JAL portrays vampires' hunger as of the non-sexual type, the urges of a non-sex-related illness. I read that dialogue as a statement of fact - Oskar does not wish to share Eli's affliction, he wants to be with Eli.
Since Eli cannot grow up, I really don't want to think of their relationship turning sexual.

I'm sure the idea of sexuality for ELi is more complex than the infliction of being a vampire - since he is a castrated boy; however sex will be an issue as Oska ages because that how it is with teenagers whether its with Eli or somebody else

Yes, of course sexuality will be an issue with Oskar. That's a big part of why I see the ending as bittersweet, because Eli will not age. In particular the very last line, 'Maybe when you're young' is very ominous.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by sexuality being more complex than being a vampire, but I imagine Eli would have a rather negative view of sexuality. Having no sex drive, he can't get any of its benefits, and he's surely known enough Hakans to have a rather negative impression of others' sexuality.

There seems to be this recurring idea that sexuality is attached to vampirism - not necessarily from you but it does seem to come up. However I expect Eli will view sex as pleasing the other person which I expect will eventually be an issue between him and Oska

[genie47]

Guys I'm not saying Oskar's rejection of being a vampire as a sexual element. I'm saying that the removal of the sexual element in their relationship has made Oskar clear on what this relationship is all about. Think of it as being a vampire a final act of committment to Eli and it is something Oskar is not prepared for, yet.

Ironically, the agreement to not sexualize the relationship as much as it lifted the pressure from Oskar, it has also not raised the stakes of the relationship in Oskar's POV. For Eli, things are way different. As pointed out by lombano, Eli is incapable of having a sex drive. So the stakes for this relationship are raised to the highest level for Eli.

This explains her return at the pool to rescue Oskar.

[genie47]

Ironically, the agreement to not sexualize the relationship as much as it lifted the pressure from Oskar, it has also not raised the stakes of the relationship in Oskar's POV. For Eli, things are way different. As pointed out by lombano, Eli is incapable of having a sex drive. So the stakes for this relationship are raised to the highest level for Eli.

This explains her return at the pool to rescue Oskar.

Sorry I had to quote my own post. This means that Oskar takes it slow in his relationship with Eli. He didn't understand the full implication of "keeping things the way they are" but after the revelation of Eli as a vampire and also a boy bought him time to decide on things. He allowed his love for Eli to ferment but he is not ready for sacrifices on his part, yet.

On the other hand, the emotional bond for Eli is everything. Even though the candy eating sacrifice in the film is not what the novel portrayed it actually tells of Eli's beginnings of utmost desire from Oskar. Then the hemorrhage and then the pool rescue, not forgetting the offer of being "like me" to Oskar. She becomes as every bit as desperate as Håkan! Willing to endanger her life for Oskar.

So as much as it is discussed that Oskar is the new Håkan, I think Eli is also the new Håkan and Oskar the new Eli!

[lombano]

I hadn't thought of Eli as the new Hakan - but maybe it's more accurate to call Eli the anti-Hakan. Hakan is driven mainly by lust, something Eli lacks, and Eli's love is extremely selfless.
It was pointed out before that Eli turning Oskar into a vampire would be a kind of marriage (both the most unholy and the most sublime) - it does require a terrible commitment from Oskar - indeed a final act for which Oskar is unprepared. As for sex, there's no way it could end well - because it is something Eli cannot want in itself.

[genie47]

The reason I view Eli as the new Håkan is from the request to Oskar if he wants to be a vampire. It mirrors Håkan's request for more than copping a feel which Eli says with a resounding "NO!"

Cut to Oskar and Eli. Oskar is now in the enviable position of Eli with respect to the Eli's former relationship with Håkan. Oskar this time offered Eli something much more. A companionship. An emotional bond which Eli yearned for. Like Håkan, she increasingly endangers herself for Oskar. Like Eli, Oskar is "powerless" against this emotional yearning from Eli. Much as Eli is actually "powerless" against the insatiable lust of Håkan when he returned as a zombie.

Unlike Eli who rejected Håkan's pleas, Oskar responds positively to Eli's plea because this also his need as well. "I am all alone, do you want to know?" Oskar did not reject her and we too are glad he didn't. It will be so tragic. JAL has built up sympathy for Håkan while we looked at Oskar with dread in the first half and then this is reversed in the second half.

As much as we view her return at the swimming pool as selfless, we can view it as selfish as well. Eli wanted Oskar so badly as much as Håkan wanted Eli so badly.

Love afterall can be viewed as possession and belonging.