Owen and Abby - What Next?

[lombano]

In the pool scene, I saw grim resignation on Owen's face. He didn't seem happy to be alive, it was as if he might've preferred to have drowned. The symbolism is obvious enough; in the novel this scene is not described directly, but the witnesses say an angel descended to save Oskar. The imagery is of salvation, even if carried out by an angel not from Heaven. In the Swedish film, the imagery is of baptism (immersion in water, being pulled out) and Oskar is overjoyed at being alive and with Eli - the imagery is of a new life, new beginnings. But in LMI, Owen doesn't seem too thrilled about being alive, and the imagery is of him lying at Abby's blood-covered feet - add in that her bare feet are used as very unsubtle motif for her vampirical weirdness, and the imagery is that Owen's fate has been sealed as Thomas's successor - the imagery is of reluctant submission to Abby's vampirism.

We've seen how Abby treats Thomas, mind you this is someone she is supposed to have cared about and yet she treats him like a Servant for most of the film. It was rather oppresive for Thomas. It almost felt that exsistent for Thomas became oppresive. As we all know, its implied heavily that Thomas was an old friend. In essence Thomas has given up so much for Abby and yet the way she treats him is really coldly. Really distant.

He has literally done everything for her that is humanly possible. This illustrates how selfish she is; it is her selfishness, as much as her vampirism, that traps everyone, including Abby, in the cycle. Abby is not malicious, but she's far more selfish than Eli.

[danielma]

In the pool scene, I saw grim resignation on Owen's face. He didn't seem happy to be alive, it was as if he might've preferred to have drowned. The symbolism is obvious enough; in the novel this scene is not described directly, but the witnesses say an angel descended to save Oskar. The imagery is of salvation, even if carried out by an angel not from Heaven. In the Swedish film, the imagery is of baptism (immersion in water, being pulled out) and Oskar is overjoyed at being alive and with Eli - the imagery is of a new life, new beginnings. But in LMI, Owen doesn't seem too thrilled about being alive, and the imagery is of him lying at Abby's blood-covered feet - add in that her bare feet are used as very unsubtle motif for her vampirical weirdness, and the imagery is that Owen's fate has been sealed as Thomas's successor - the imagery is of reluctant submission to Abby's vampirism.

We've seen how Abby treats Thomas, mind you this is someone she is supposed to have cared about and yet she treats him like a Servant for most of the film. It was rather oppresive for Thomas. It almost felt that exsistent for Thomas became oppresive. As we all know, its implied heavily that Thomas was an old friend. In essence Thomas has given up so much for Abby and yet the way she treats him is really coldly. Really distant.

He has literally done everything for her that is humanly possible. This illustrates how selfish she is; it is her selfishness, as much as her vampirism, that traps everyone, including Abby, in the cycle. Abby is not malicious, but she's far more selfish than Eli.

Agreed...I never really got the feeling that Owen was too happy to see her at the Pool side. He tries to give of a slight smile, but it always feels when I watch that scene that Owen may have other thoughts on the mind. Like he knows what is to be asked. He does give a glint smile but it always seems overweighed by a whole bunch of other conflicting emotions.

As for Abby's selfishness. You nailed the reason as to why I hate the comic book series (Crossroads). You think she is selfish in the movie, they go the full hog with depicting her selfishness in those books.

I don't believe Abby is a sociopath, I do believe there is apart of her that cares. But the problem I have is she almost overburdened by the knowledge of her cycle and what she will ask these people to do for her. She may care, but she has no desire to change her ways. Her way of dealing is simply to move straight on, but you always get the sense from Abby that she knows that this isn't going to end well for those involed. I mean she has her eyes on Owen and is still willing to let Thomas suffer for her...your right about the selfishness

Your right her Selfishness gets in the way, and in a way it kind of makes it hard to really care about her. You get the sense she knows but at the same time has no desire to change her ways.

I will never say she is Sociopathic though.

[lombano]

Yes - I didn't find her that sympathetic, though I felt sorry for her - even though in some sense her fate is more hopeless than Eli's - at least Eli has something different, special with Oskar, her selfishness makes her far less sympathetic.

[waggy05]

The main point is the word following Oh.. Is it Cr*p, what have I gotten myself into or something else.

More like: Oh, are you here sort of. He doesn't show joy, or fear. or, anything. Just, Oh.

...not the way I see it at all. I think he's like "oh, sweet. I can get the f*** out of this town and live the rest of my life with this beautiful, haunting, terrifying, yet caring creature".

[DavidZahir]

I get a sense of a very complex relationship between Thomas and Abby, one that has become something mired in bitterness. My own theory is that as he went through puberty, Thomas pressured her to do some things she didn't want, and that poisoned all that followed. Just my theory.

As for Abby and Owen--methinks they genuinely care for one another, and in the end it all depends on what happens. And no one knows that.

We all have different reactions. I felt enormous sympathy for Abby--and I'm utterly certain that was not a unique reaction.

[danielma]

I get a sense of a very complex relationship between Thomas and Abby, one that has become something mired in bitterness. My own theory is that as he went through puberty, Thomas pressured her to do some things she didn't want, and that poisoned all that followed. Just my theory.

As for Abby and Owen--methinks they genuinely care for one another, and in the end it all depends on what happens. And no one knows that.

We all have different reactions. I felt enormous sympathy for Abby--and I'm utterly certain that was not a unique reaction.

I'd like to believe that it might actually make me feel something more for Abby.

But the sad thing is that everything implies to it be the oppesite way. That Thomas has sacrificed so much for Abby and yet has never really recieved anything in gratiude or return. It feels to me that over the years he has come to realize this and resent this. I only come to these conclusions because of the way she treats him, its a very oppresive relationship. With the exception of the one time he yells at her, it seems that she is the one with complete control over everything and that maybe he has come to realize this over the years.

I'm more interested in the reason as to why it never occured to Abby to turn him. If she cared about him at all, then why was that never an option...and what implies that she will turn Owen in that case...that was always the biggest flaw in LMI that was opened up with the heavy implications of the Thomas backstory

[DavidZahir]

That Thomas has sacrificed so much for Abby and yet has never really recieved anything in gratiude or return. It feels to me that over the years he has come to realize this and resent this.

Never? Really? They've been together for something like four decades and you can tell Thomas has never really received anything in gratitude or return?

I don't believe you. Methinks it is pretty clear you have projected something onto this relationship that comes from you, not what was there on the screen to see. Apart from anything else, at the hospital we can see a glimpse of what these two once shared--the tenderness, the friendship, even the intimacy. Just as before he went out that last time she seemed to feel guilty, to want to comfort him, yet issues got in the way.

[danielma]

I don't believe you. Methinks it is pretty clear you have projected something onto this relationship that comes from you, not what was there on the screen to see. Apart from anything else, at the hospital we can see a glimpse of what these two once shared--the tenderness, the friendship, even the intimacy. Just as before he went out that last time she seemed to feel guilty, to want to comfort him, yet issues got in the way.

Really? Because I'm pretty sure I saw her treating him like a servant during most of their interactions. For someone who supposedly cares about Thomas, she sure is quite cold to him. One scene of regret vs an entire movie of Abby being somewhat cold to Thomas and treating him like a servant.

I'm just stating what I saw though.

And I'm not twisting anything, in the comic books there is a moment where Thomas shows some clear resent over what it is he has done for her when she is interacting with that kid John. Granted I know the comic books shouldn't factor into the stand alone movie, but they are still set in the universe of LMI and yes it strengthend what I already felt about Thomas. It seemed to me that Thomas in the movie was getting tired of it and actually was beginning to realize what a life he has wasted. But once again that's what I saw

[DavidZahir]

Really? Because I'm pretty sure I saw her treating him like a servant during most of their interactions. For someone who supposedly cares about Thomas, she sure is quite cold to him. One scene of regret vs an entire movie of Abby being somewhat cold to Thomas and treating him like a servant.

Now you're backtracking, from "never really recieved anything in gratiude or return" to "treating him like a servant during most of their interactions" and even acknowledging "one scene of regret" (there were two--out of, by my quick count, six or seven scenes the two had together).

I've only read the first comic book and wasn't terribly impressed. Seems to me the writer was aiming for something along the lines of 30 Days of Night, which doesn't really fit with the film IMHO. The relationship between Abby and Thomas came across to me as much more complex than that between (for example) Dracula and Renfield. More like a marriage that had gone wrong, become tainted by past mistakes and words/deeds that couldn't be taken back. It seemed tragic, but also very much determined by the individuals involved, and frankly full of hints of past happiness together--including the way his face lit up when she opened to door insisting on using the room next to Owen's. Something must have inspired such a reaction--and the tenderness of their last moments together hinted at more, a lot more.

[danielma]

Really? Because I'm pretty sure I saw her treating him like a servant during most of their interactions. For someone who supposedly cares about Thomas, she sure is quite cold to him. One scene of regret vs an entire movie of Abby being somewhat cold to Thomas and treating him like a servant.

Now you're backtracking, from "never really recieved anything in gratiude or return" to "treating him like a servant during most of their interactions" and even acknowledging "one scene of regret" (there were two--out of, by my quick count, six or seven scenes the two had together).

I've only read the first comic book and wasn't terribly impressed. Seems to me the writer was aiming for something along the lines of 30 Days of Night, which doesn't really fit with the film IMHO. The relationship between Abby and Thomas came across to me as much more complex than that between (for example) Dracula and Renfield. More like a marriage that had gone wrong, become tainted by past mistakes and words/deeds that couldn't be taken back. It seemed tragic, but also very much determined by the individuals involved, and frankly full of hints of past happiness together--including the way his face lit up when she opened to door insisting on using the room next to Owen's. Something must have inspired such a reaction--and the tenderness of their last moments together hinted at more, a lot more.

The comics are terrible, The only reason I count them though is because they do come from the source of LMI's universe. But I will say the Comic Books do not do a world of good to your arguements. They paint Abby as having nothing more than two thoughts of mind "I'm hungry" and "Where's Thomas with my food". They don't do a lot to help your arguements.

I'm not backtracking, why? Because I really don't see that scene witth Abby placing Thomas' hand on her cheek to be a tender scene at all. That is essentially Abby's breakup scene with Thomas in my mind. Its the scene where she clearly has chosen Owen. When he askes her not to see that boy again, she doesn't defy like a teenager or a child. It gives off almost the sense of a break up to me. But yet she is still willing to let him once again risk his life for her. At this point, all the evidence points to the fact that she has Owen in mind. The relationship at this point is long over between her and Thomas. That's not a tender scene to me at all, so I don't count it.

For the most part she treats him like a servant. First time we're introduced to him and her, he's following her almost like a servant. The constant beratings, the line of dialog "Maybe I'm getting tired". It hints that the guy is maybe starting to realize in his life what he has missed out on. That maybe he has wasted his life on a false ideal.

The only scene where we get any true sense of tenderness between them is the Hospital scene, but its too little, too late at this point for me. They've already made the strong emphasis of this relationship going sour.

The problem I have is the movie makes no implicatations to prove that this will end with Owen. In fact it makes the same implications that this is only starting for Owen. The movie almost comes full circle of sorts. We see the tragic end, followed by the hopeful beginnings. There is no sense of a change that will happen for Abby. Because of the heavy emphasis on the downside of the relationship angle, it just makes it feel to me that Owen isn't escaping Oppression, it just feels like he is entering a life of further Oppression in the long haul.

Maybe it wasn't Reeves intention, but my problem is he heavily implys it. Just look at the way he positions his shot of Owen at Abby's bloody feet looking up at her. Its so reminiscent of a Servant.