Discussion (spoilers)

For discussion of John Ajvide Lindqvist's short story collection Låt de gamla drömmarna dö
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StefL
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by StefL » Fri Sep 07, 2012 8:02 am

EEA wrote:It could also happened by accident. Maybe they were just there for vacations, spending their last moments together, when maybe Stefan decides to take a photograph, and later when they see it, there in the background are Eli and Oskar.
Or they do meet with Eli and Oskar and then that way Karin and Stefan tell them how they are part of their love story. Or Karin dies and Stefan sees the photo when the one who took it is looking at it, then he goes to Karin's grave and tells her about the photo. Or the person that sends the photo is someone who works in the police and who sends the photo.

So many possibilities.
I believe you missed the point here. Someone within the police had sent the picture to Karin marked "this might interest you" or something like that. I.e. the family in the picture has nothing to do with the characters in the story, it's just a family photo where Oskar and Eli happened to be caught in the background from the flash. What's relevant though is that whoever took the picture must have recognised Oskar, i.e. it must have been someone who knew him once, since the person thought it relevant to hand the picture over to the police. It's been speculated here before (the story's been available in Swedish for >20 months) that it might have been Tommy, or someone else who knew Oskar before he disappeared.

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metoo
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by metoo » Fri Sep 07, 2012 3:28 pm

My bet is that it wasn't Tommy, since he knew Eli. Maybe Johan, though.
But from the beginning Eli was just Eli. Nothing. Anything. And he is still a mystery to me. John Ajvide Lindqvist

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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by EEA » Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:23 am

Is still nice just to speculate. ;)

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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by intrige » Sat Sep 08, 2012 12:29 pm

My FF : The fuontian of love, explores that it was Johan ;)
http://let-the-right-one-in.com/fancont ... ntain-love
It's written long ago, long after I had read the epiologe. ;) I like understanding swedish. :D
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Nightrider » Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:29 am

"LET THE OLD DREAMS DIE" anthology. (no spoilers)

Due to some life related delays I'm going slow with this book.
Just finished two stories.

"Border" A vast, sprawling tale that had me completely fooled and frustrated almost until the very last page. The resolution of the story was somewhat unexpected, but very satisfying. Good piece of fantasy writing.....or was it real? 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-)

"Let The Old Dreams Die" I've read it before in another form some time ago as it found it's way to my e-mail box. Knowing all the particulars did not diminish the power of the narrative. All the strong points are still there and reading the story felt as if it was a first time. A welcome and decisive conclusion to a great novel. 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-)

Can't wait to read more. Must savor it. Novel X is nowhere near the end, so this means the LTODD will be the last of JAL's writings for a while.
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by drakkar » Mon Sep 10, 2012 6:16 am

Nightrider wrote:"Border" A vast, sprawling tale that had me completely fooled and frustrated almost until the very last page. The resolution of the story was somewhat unexpected, but very satisfying. Good piece of fantasy writing.....or was it real? 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-)
Well, trolls are part of the Norse folklore, and from one who also is part of it: Yes it had a very realistic feel. John takes some liberties with the folklore (or should we say "develops it a bit"), and the result is abolutely smashing.
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by Wolfchild » Tue Sep 11, 2012 1:49 am

Nightrider wrote:Can't wait to read more. Must savor it. Novel X is nowhere near the end, so this means the LTODD will be the last of JAL's writings for a while.
There were some rumors that Tjärven could released in English as an ebook around the end of 2012. I'm pinning my hopes on that.

Either that, or LTODD really takes off in the US. St Martin's Press convinces John to do a book tour. I get to meet him and take a pic of him holding my stuffed Woofy avatar. :mrgreen:
...the story derives a lot of its appeal from its sense of despair and a darkness in which the love of Eli and Oskar seems to shine with a strange and disturbing light.
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by danielma » Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:11 am

Someone within the police had sent the picture to Karin marked "this might interest you" or something like that. I.e. the family in the picture has nothing to do with the characters in the story, it's just a family photo where Oskar and Eli happened to be caught in the background from the flash. What's relevant though is that whoever took the picture must have recognised Oskar, i.e. it must have been someone who knew him once, since the person thought it relevant to hand the picture over to the police. It's been speculated here before (the story's been available in Swedish for >20 months) that it might have been Tommy, or someone else who knew Oskar before he disappeared.
In the English Translation it says "someone who had lived in Blackeberg and knew Oskar very well"...my first thought jumped to either Tommy or potentially Johan...another thought was that maybe it was some random School kid who knew Oskar...after all, the note does mention that "it's kind of crazy but just look at the photo"...maybe it was just another School kid who grew up knowing of the Poolside Massacre and looked at the photo and thought they saw Oskar...

Then another thought occured that maybe (and this is the one I'm betting on) it was Mr Avila...after all, Avila was Spanish (from memory, someone correct me if I'm wrong, I'm sure he was Spanish) and the photo is taken in Barcelona (the second largest city in Spain)...if I had to put money on it, I might go for Avila being the one that sent the photo in...Avila grew close to Oskar, after all he was the one adult that could have potentially saved Oskar. He never met Eli (so he wouldn't know who Eli was in the photo). Of course he would think it was crazy, considering he would probably be thinking that Oskar would be in his late thirties-early forties by now...I don't know, I just think the pieces point to Avila


Okay, done reading...Fantastic...in every single way. I had trepidation about this when I first heard he was writing this epilogue...but I got to say, it's downright beautiful. Very touching, and does the same thing that LTROI did, still leaves it very much open to speculation.

Again, just a story that touched me very dearly and one that I openly related too. The narrator's friendship with Karin and Steffan reminded me a lot of a friendship that I currently have with two of my nearest and dearest friends. Who are married and have a child together. It was that really sweet endearing friendship between those three that really moved me.

A few points

- Considering they were so in love with one another, why is it that Karin and Steffan never had kids? This got me thinking, the narrator describes them often as being a very close couple...surely you would believe that a couple that were so close and so much in love would want to try for children. Was Karin infertile? Was that why she had such a fascination with this case...I mean I know it's the case that bought her to her husband, but what else motivated her? Was it the fact that Oskar was so young and that it reminded her of the inability to have children? Did she become attached in her own way (much like we the infected are attached to these two kids)

- I love the ending...I love the fact that it is left open and yet it's still kind of a happy ending in it's own dubious way. Maybe they met their grissly ending by meeting Oskar and Eli. Maybe they never found Oskar and Eli. Maybe time ran out on Steffan (considering he wasn't given much time due to the cancer). Maybe they found Oskar and Eli and maybe Oskar and Eli shared it with them. Maybe they received it and decided it wasn't for them and burnt up in suicide. Or maybe they just continued to chase their dreams and found happiness in the fact that Karin was right all along. I don't think it really matters what happens next, and that's the charm of it...much like it was for LTROI to begin. It's a story of love that is left open for us to contemplate what happens next. And I thought that it worked wonderfully whilst managing to provide a bit of closure regarding Oskar and Eli's own predicament (at least in terms of what became of Oskar).
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by intrige » Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:56 am

drakkar wrote:
Nightrider wrote:"Border" A vast, sprawling tale that had me completely fooled and frustrated almost until the very last page. The resolution of the story was somewhat unexpected, but very satisfying. Good piece of fantasy writing.....or was it real? 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-)
Well, trolls are part of the Norse folklore, and from one who also is part of it: Yes it had a very realistic feel. John takes some liberties with the folklore (or should we say "develops it a bit"), and the result is abolutely smashing.
I also had a good feel for Grense, border, Grans? Yeh.. grense in norwegian anyway. I do recall from long ago me and Drakkar chatting about it and.. He told me that JAL after writing Border, finally understood himself that he was a good writer. After LTROI, after Handling the undead.. So yeh, that's interesting!

I borrowed the book from the school library, I no longer go to that school. Life goes on eh? I feel like reading Border again, LTODD have with the book LTODD. But Paper walls? No, I have not. And should buy within the nearest future. Cause it was a good book. I also remember liking the short story Paper walls as well. Hm, yeh I don't recall much more of it actually.
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drakkar
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Re: Discussion (spoilers)

Post by drakkar » Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:01 am

danielma wrote:- Considering they were so in love with one another, why is it that Karin and Steffan never had kids? This got me thinking, the narrator describes them often as being a very close couple...surely you would believe that a couple that were so close and so much in love would want to try for children. Was Karin infertile? Was that why she had such a fascination with this case...I mean I know it's the case that bought her to her husband, but what else motivated her? Was it the fact that Oskar was so young and that it reminded her of the inability to have children? Did she become attached in her own way (much like we the infected are attached to these two kids)
From the top of my head, Karin was about eighty when they left for Barcelona, making her well into the fifties when she and Stefan met. So yes, I believe she was to old for kids.
For the heart life is simple. It beats as long as it can.
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