She and he

[steviej]

I'm new to the forum and I know the subject of gender has been discussed a million times so sorry if this has already been covered. The thing I am interested in is JAL's use of the pronoun "she" up to a certain point and then in the middle of the page at a certain point in the novel switches to "he" - describing Elias of course, Is this the same in the original Swedish version?
I am not sure how I feel about this - the story is not written from Elias perspective and so it seems a deliberate attempt by JAL to mislead the reader first in to thinking Elias is a girl and then explicitly confirming he is a boy. I don't mean any disrespect to JAL when I say this because I am infected and think the novel is great. If not mislead then deliberately direct the reader in this way. Personally I would have been happy for the ambiguity to have been retained with the female pronoun used throughout and with all the other ambiguous references left in. I think this is a small thing and about the only thing that grated with me on my first reading

Steviej

[steviej]

Sorry - just read kaontos topic http://www.let-the-right-one-in.com/for ... 568#p38423 which seems to cover the point . Apologies to JAL it seems the Swedish version does retain the ambiguity throughout by avoiding the use of "she" and "he" - shame I can't speak\read Swedish!!

Steviej

[a_contemplative_life]

It has been awhile since I read the novel, but as I remember it, the switch in gender pronoun occurs at the point where Oskar begins to understand Eli's true gender. This makes sense when we consider that the story is told primarily from Oskar's perspective. I don't think the pronouns are used randomly in the story or without deliberate purpose.

[steviej]

But I do not like this aspect of the English translation. It is unsubtle compared to everything else in the novel and indeed the whole treatment of Elias' gender.

Steviej

[metoo]

... Is this the same in the original Swedish version? ...

Yes. Like ACL writes, the story is told through Oskar's perspective. JAL's intention (as revealed in interviews) was to for Eli to be hermaphroditic, to have no clear gender. This is reflected in his girlish appearance, and boyish behaviour when playing with Oskar. (He didn't want to be the Fair Maiden to be saved, but the horrible monster who ate fair maidens for lunch.)

[ofelia]

But I do not like this aspect of the English translation. It is unsubtle compared to everything else in the novel and indeed the whole treatment of Elias' gender.

I agree with that, having read it first in English, then in Swedish. If you can read both you'll notice than in every scene between Eli and Hakan there is no reference at all to Eli's gender. In Swedish you can do this because the pronoun applies to the gender of the noun, not the person, but in English you have to specify every time Eli does anything. I didn't like that, but there's really no way around it. I do have to say that I read it a couple of times in English and the switch from 'she' to 'he' feels like it was put in the right place. Because before that, from Oskar's perspective, he assumed Eli was a girl. And at the point when it starts referring to Eli as 'he' it's because Oskar knows Eli's secrets now but that doesn't matter to him (whether Eli is a boy or a girl or a vampire). And I loved that. It's about loving the person for who they are. To me their relationship is twice as moving because of Eli's asexuality.

There is also one point where Hakan imagines Eli as a 'boy angel', and this is in the Swedish as well, early on. I thought that was a little distracting, because you're not supposed to know yet.

[DMt.]

Yes. To all of that.

And I can testify to the horrendous difficulties involved in trying to keep Eli [or anybody] gender-undefined in English. I ended up having to use the name excessively, or devices like 'the beloved face' instead of 'his/her face'.

I have an uneasy feeling that this reflects a deep-rooted and ancient misogyny in English culture, that the language has become structured in such a way as to purport that the most important thing about Eli, or anybody, is their gender.

[TigerEyes]

i agree, i have a difficult time trying to write about Eli without referring to he or she. There's no way around it. But i chose to just go with He. Basically because biologically, Eli's a boy.

[Casper]

In all posts i make here, I usually find that I have inadvertently used a mix of him / her throughout the wording. This is the first time in my life I have had this problem, trying to remember to be consistent.

[bore]

I find it very practical. Sometimes you want to hightlight Eli as a male and sometimes as a female, being able to switch between she and he (sometimes mid-sentence) simplifies this IMO.